Where's the hold

Hi All,

I am making a water based pomade. I heat my water and oils separately at 160 degrees for 20 minutes. Emulsification is working perfectly, product is not separating. I am adding Carboxymethyl Cellulose (CMC) after emulsification with the intention that this will give the product hold. I am using beeswax as well, but don't want to use too much as it will be too difficult to wash out. I'm using about 15% beeswax. Anyway, the purpose for the CMC was to be a substitute for PVP. I looked for PVP alternatives, and found Gum Arabic and CMC. I must be doing something wrong, or misunderstanding what CMC is supposed to be doing. As a thickener, it's great, but it adds no stickyness, which is what I'm looking for. Any suggestions?

Thanks     

Comments

  • BelassiBelassi Member, PCF student
    Just a note, which is to say, we use degrees Celsius in chemistry. Unfortunately I can't help with your problem since it's an area outside my experience.
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • Bill_TogeBill_Toge Member, Professional Chemist
    what you need is a film-forming resin, which gum arabic and CMC are not

    most resins suitable for haircare are related to PVP, and many of them have no effect on viscosity at all
    UK based formulation chemist. Strongest subjects: hair styling, hair bleaches, hair dyes (oxidative and non-oxidative) I know some stuff about: EU regulations, emulsions (O/W and W/O), toothpaste, mouthwash, shampoos, other toiletries
  • Thanks Bill, Anything other than PVP that will do the trick? Something easy to purchase online maybe?

    Thanks
  • BobzchemistBobzchemist Member, PCF student
    There are plenty of alternatives, but they're all almost impossible to buy online, since they are for professionals/corporations.

    What are you trying to accomplish with your pomade project?
    Robert Zonis, Sr. Formulation Chemist, Beaumont Products "All opinions and comments expressed are my own, have no relation to Beaumont Products, are fully copyrighted, and may not be used without written permission."
  • I'm basically making it for myself, maybe give it to a few friends. It's a creative outlet, I like making it and would like for it to have more hold like commercial products.
  • johnbjohnb Member, Professional Chemist
    PVP K30 is available on eBay USA where is is called povidone (not povidone iodine) and UK (as PVP).
  • Bill_TogeBill_Toge Member, Professional Chemist
    you could also try alibaba.com; a number of suppliers claim to sell in lots of 1kg or less, and some claim to sell VP/VA copolymer too, in similar quantities (these are the two generic non-proprietary resins widely used in this kind of product)

    as always, be wary when ordering things from China!
    UK based formulation chemist. Strongest subjects: hair styling, hair bleaches, hair dyes (oxidative and non-oxidative) I know some stuff about: EU regulations, emulsions (O/W and W/O), toothpaste, mouthwash, shampoos, other toiletries
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