I need your help in makin soap base face wash

I making soap base face wash but its not have enough foaming and its foaming become decreased day by day
plz give me the solution 
Formula:
Stearic acid  14 %
Myristic acid 7.5 %
EGDS 2 %
CMC  0.5%
Glycerine 2% 
SLES   6% 
SLS  2%
Cocobetain  2%
KoH   4% 
Phenoxyethanol  0.5%
Water to make 100% 
Plz tell me the solution or give me a proper formulation 

Comments

  • Please help me 
    No one reply me here
  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    edited April 2018
    Usman with that much fatty acids nothing would foam. Increase the SLES & SLS by 2-3 times each and reduce each fatty acid by 50% or 2/3rd. Try and come back with your observation.
  • BelassiBelassi Member, PCF student
    Put the fatty acids into soapcalc.net and calculate the amount of KOH to saponify them. Do that first and then add the result to the rest.
    HOWEVER I have to say that I have been down this route and I do not recommend it. Go either soap based or synthetic.
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • Chemist77Chemist77 Member, PCF student
    Agree with @Belassi, it’s kinda complicated stuff and the stability versus performance is a big trouble.
  • BelassiBelassi Member, PCF student
    The percentage of KOH is approximately correct, but I suspect that if not precombined, the reaction time would be very lengthy. Not only that, you end up with a pH of about 9 to 10. 
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • Why not saponify an oil, for example extra virgin olive oil, and leave out all the other stuff?

     We do this and it is a huge success for our own brand and the other OEM brands we manufacture for.
    Dr. Mike Thair
    Cofounder & Chief Formulator
    Indochine Natural
  • UsmanAliUsmanAli Member
    edited May 2018
    Thanks to all for helping
    Sir i have tried again as following 
    Myristic acid 8 %
    Stearic acid 12% 
    SLS 2% 
    SLES 5 %
    Cocobetain 4% 
    K-D 2% 
    KoH 4.5% 
    PG 1%
    Glycerine 2% 
    CMC O.5 % 
    PH=8
    The foaming is increased but it become separate after  10 days 2 layers apeared 
    Plz help me with a stable formulation please i m so worried 
  • GuntherGunther Member
    edited May 2018
    While Potassium myristate (from reacting Myristic acid + KOH) seems to be a bit soluble, Potassium stearate is likely insoluble.

    Please read the study
    The solubility of sodium and potassium soaps and the phase diagrams of aqueous potassium soaps

    The only soaps that are even moderately soluble at room temperature are potassium laurate, myristate, and oleate, the potassium salt of acids from coconut oil, and the sodium oleate. The other sodium and potassium soaps of the saturated fatty acids require elevated temperatures for solution.
    https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02645899


    So you're limited to Potassium hydroxide (to make Potassium salts), coconut oil, lauric, myristic and oleic acid.

    With other oils, you may wait for the insoluble soaps to precipitate down, then draw the upper layer with just the soluble ones
    but I don't know if you'll need a centrifuge for that.

  • How about adding some emulsifier like GMS 1-2% and Cetyl stearyl alcohol 0.5-3%?
    Though it might decrease the pearl effect and become cream like.
  • DavidDavid Member
    edited June 2018
    Is there an advantage mixing soap and an SLS/SLES/CAPB based recipe?
    Sounds to me you need to get rid of the "soap based" idea - your recipe is anyway not 100% soap based so why bother?
  • BelassiBelassi Member, PCF student
    ^^^ What David said. Think: Does soap have properties better than the synthetics? It doesn't clean better, it doesn't have more foam... but it does come with a high pH that makes preservation more problematic. Most factors sell potassium cocoate, a liquid soap. If you try washing your face with it, soon you'll wish you hadn't because your skin will dry out. Is that really something you want in a product? As I said, I have wasted enough time on all this to know that it doesn't work.
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
  • UsmanAliBelassi they do have a high pH and this eliminates the need for preservatives. And no, with the correct selection of oils and careful saponification calculations, liquid soap WILL NOT dry out the skin. If they did, I would have been out of business years ago.


    Dr. Mike Thair
    Cofounder & Chief Formulator
    Indochine Natural
  • BelassiBelassi Member, PCF student
    Mike, you failed to note what I said: potassium cocoate, a liquid soap. If you try washing your face with it, soon you'll wish you hadn't because your skin will dry out.
    Cosmetic Brand Creation. Concept to name to IMPI search to logo and brand registration. In-house graphic design inc. Pantone specs. Cosmetic label and box design & graphics.
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