Rosemary and Rye Flour Quandary

kcrysskcryss Member
edited May 2019 in Hair
Hi Everyone,
I would really love some help/advice and 2 things.
  1. Why this combination works
  2. How can I stabalize it so that I don't have to make it fresh before each hair washing.
After trying many many difference shampoos on the market over the last several years and still not happy with any of them, I came across a blog about "No Poo,". After a great deal of research I finally decided to try one of the options I found interesting. Rosemary and Rye Flour. Most of the others out there look to be damaging. This was the only one I felt might actually work without causing a great deal of damage and frustration. I have baby fine hair that has a tendency to be oily. Until now. This combination, for whatever reason actually works. My hair does not go "flat" within 2 hours and is not oily by the evening/following morning.

Prodecure that I use:
Steep about a tablespoon of dried rosemary leaves in 1/2 cup boiling water for 30 to 60 minutes in a covered dish.
Add about 1/4 cup water (adds additional liquid and helps to cool)
Add 1 tablespoon rye flour
shake and use immediately.
I leave this in my hair for 3 to 5 minutes, rinse well, then use an apple cider vinegar rinse. (1 tablespoon ACV and 1/4 cup water)
I will sometimes use a very tiny bit of coconut oil on the ends.

Does anyone know why this works?
Is there some way to preserve the rosemary infusion to prevent it spoiling so it doesn't have to be made every day? Or even better, a way to preserve the rosemary/rye flour to prevent mold baceteria etc. At this point I've considered canning the rosemary in small canning jars for single use. I've also purchased some germall plus powder, but not sure if it would work or even how much to use.

Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

Comments

  • kcrysskcryss Member
    Additional notes:
    I believe the rye flour is what helps with adding body. I just don't know why it helps.
    I live in a very arid climate, but when I go to a humid area, my hair does have bounce and body and this was prior to discovering rosemary/rye flour.
    Also, I learned many years ago that blow drying, heat styling only works to remove moisure even faster.
    Also, I had to stop using conditioners for the same reasons.
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    It is difficult to answer your question without you explaining what you mean by some of your terms.

    When you ask "why this works?" what exactly do you mean? What are the indications that the product is working? Specifically, how is your hair different when you use this treatment versus a standard shampoo and conditioner treatment? How is it different from doing no treatment or just rinsing your hair with water?

    In truth, there is no simple answer to your question. The most likely answer is that you enjoy the process of creating and using the treatment, which makes you believe your hair is in great condition. A scientific evaluation of your hair after treatment may indicate that your hair is actually not more clean than a standard shampoo/conditioner wash, but that matters less than how you feel about it.

    There is nothing special in rosemary or rye flour that would be beneficial to hair. The chemical composition of rye flour isn't that much different than that of wheat flour. Also, there is nothing particularly good about rinsing your hair with apple cider vinegar. There is zero scientific evidence that it's good for hair or that it cleans hair. 

    Cosmetic science is not an exact science. And psychological effects are a big part of the functioning of cosmetics.
  • CazPCazP Member
    Have you tried a Rosemary Hydrosol? More expensive but convenient if it works. Other thoughts are milling the rosemary to a fine powder and mixing with your rye flour so you can store as a dry powder then hydrate as required. Possibly needing a bit longer steeping or leaving in hair.

    I make a rosemary leaf tea and preserve with Geogard ECT for a facial tonic.
  • kcrysskcryss Member
    Perry said:
    It is difficult to answer your question without you explaining what you mean by some of your terms.

    When you ask "why this works?" what exactly do you mean? What are the indications that the product is working? Specifically, how is your hair different when you use this treatment versus a standard shampoo and conditioner treatment? How is it different from doing no treatment or just rinsing your hair with water?

    In truth, there is no simple answer to your question. The most likely answer is that you enjoy the process of creating and using the treatment, which makes you believe your hair is in great condition. A scientific evaluation of your hair after treatment may indicate that your hair is actually not more clean than a standard shampoo/conditioner wash, but that matters less than how you feel about it.

    There is nothing special in rosemary or rye flour that would be beneficial to hair. The chemical composition of rye flour isn't that much different than that of wheat flour. Also, there is nothing particularly good about rinsing your hair with apple cider vinegar. There is zero scientific evidence that it's good for hair or that it cleans hair. 

    Cosmetic science is not an exact science. And psychological effects are a big part of the functioning of cosmetics.
    Hi Perry,

    Thank you for the response and for putting up this website. :)

    To answer your questions, I don't feel that this method makes my hair feel cleaner then with using traditional shampoo/conditioner, but it does feel clean in the sense that it is still "squeaky" clean from roots to ends as with regular shampoo. My hair produces far too many oils to just rinse with water. There is no "squeaky" clean with water only.

    The main reason I like this method is that my hair feels and looks healthier then when I use shampoo/conditioner. There is body and bounce and it doesn't lay flat against my head within a couple of hours after washing it. I have no scientific proof that it's better, but I have had a number of positive comments from people that do not know that I'm doing this.

    I've been using this method for about 5 months. I've tried other solutions, attempted several hair thickening shampoos and conditions, none of which produces the same "fluffy" feeling/looking results. I've tried a number of shampoos for fine hair and again the result is always the same.

    I really don't know why this works, I only know that it does.

    With regard to the difference between rye/wheat flour, there is a difference. Not sure if it's the amount of gluten or something else, but if you try this with wheat flour it will not work. The wheat flour wants to hang out with your hair and trying to rinse it out is a disaster.

    With respect to liking the creation and use of the treatment, in the beginning yes it was fun to do the first few times. However, because it requires a great deal of planning just to wash my hair it has become a nuisance. I can't just jump out of bed in the morning and hop into the shower on days I need to wash my hair.  Hence my questions here.

    To sum it up, my hair is not "cleaner" with this method, it has more volume and bounce without getting greasy between washings. Whatever is in regular shampoos (either the surfactants, the silicones or something else) weigh it down. This method does not weigh my hair down.
  • kcrysskcryss Member
    CazP said:
    Have you tried a Rosemary Hydrosol? More expensive but convenient if it works. Other thoughts are milling the rosemary to a fine powder and mixing with your rye flour so you can store as a dry powder then hydrate as required. Possibly needing a bit longer steeping or leaving in hair.

    I make a rosemary leaf tea and preserve with Geogard ECT for a facial tonic.

    The Geogard ECT does not cause irritation? I guess that was my main reason for asking about a way to preserve the rosemary. Canning was my initial thought, but that can be a pain too and having all the little jars stored somewhere.
    I have not tried a hydrosol as my understanding is that the process is basically distilling. Would the hydrosol have the same properties as from steeping the whole herb?

    Thanks for resonding by the way. :)
  • CazPCazP Member
    I have had no reported irritation from Geogard ECT, it is the preservative I use for all my emulsions. My skin is not really sensitive but I have test subjects who do have. I don't have any comparison info for hydrosol vs steeped, just an idea.
  • kcrysskcryss Member
    Thank you so much CazP. I will try it with the Germall that I have now and order some Geogard ECT. At the very least I will be able to make the rosemary water ahead of time and just mix the rye flour fresh.
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