sulfate free shampoo

StanleyStanley Member
A few questions...
1) trying to find a good combo of sulfate free surfactants to make a shampoo that will have a nice viscosity (5k-7k cps).  I was asked not to use salts.  Is the thickness also dependent on the pH?  I am using Caltaine-30, Decyl Glucoside, as of right now. open to suggestions....


2) I noticed with some sulfate free brands they are using a rheology modifier of some sort...a carbomer, gum...is this necessary?
3)What makes a shampoo a "conditioning shampoo?"  
4) What makes a "color safe" shampoo?

thanks!


Comments

  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    A few answers

    2.  Yes. Carbomer is a thickener & if you want a formula thicker than water that's one option.

    3.  Conditioning shampoos contain some type of conditioning ingredient that gets left behind during the shampoo process. Typically, a silicone like Dimethicone and a cationic polymer like Polyquaternium 10

    4.  Marketing. 
  • HenryHenry Member
    Wow!  I thought color safe would have something to do with an ingredient to help color dye to stay in the hair.  So any "mild" detergency shampoo would do for this?
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    @Henry - by far the biggest factor involved in removing color from the hair is water. When you get hair wet, it swells and some of the dye molecules leak out and get washed away. There isn't really much measurable difference between shampoos. Lots of companies pretend there is though.

  • HenryHenry Member
    just another question...  
    to build viscosity in a sulfate free system is it also pH dependent?
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    I think that depends on the specific surfactants used.
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    @Stanley:

    You'll want to stay away from non-ionics such as Decyl Glucoside as they are extraordinarily difficult to thicken or just use them in small quantities.  

    Good combinations would be Sodium Cocoyl Isethionate + Cocamidopropyl Betaine + Coco Betaine + Cocamidopropyl Hydroxysultaine and thicken it up with Polyquaternium-10 and/or Guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride if you want a conditioning shampoo.  You can also use Acrylates CoPolymer (BASF TTA) as a thickener.

    I have recently been using Sorbithix L100 from AppleChem as a thickener and find it does a good job ... nice, clear product and easy to incorporate.
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
  • HenryHenry Member
    @MarkBroussard thank you for the tip.  So in general non ionic surfactants are hard to thicken?  Is pH a factor in this or is there another mechanism...
  • MarkBroussardMarkBroussard Member, Professional Chemist
    @Henry:

    No, it's not a function of pH with the non-ionics, it's that they are non-ionic ... no charge density
    Chemist/Microbiologist formulating in the Organic & Naturals arena under ECOCert/Natural Products Assn/Whole Foods/National Organic Program guidelines focused skincare & haircare products. 

    See website for details www.desertinbloomcosmeticslab.com
  • High viscosity HPMC also works as thickner in Shampoo
  • HenryHenry Member
    @abdullah.  thank you! which brand do you use?

  • You can use any brand. I purchase locally and forgot the manufacturer name but it was 200000 mpas viscosity. 
  • HenryHenry Member
    @abdullah thank you so much! :)
  • AndraousAndraous Member
    edited April 30
    Perry said:
    A few answers

    2.  Yes. Carbomer is a thickener & if you want a formula thicker than water that's one option.

    3.  Conditioning shampoos contain some type of conditioning ingredient that gets left behind during the shampoo process. Typically, a silicone like Dimethicone and a cationic polymer like Polyquaternium 10

    4.  Marketing.
    Hi. How can we avoid blurry lotion when use carbomer21 to prepare shampoo
  • PerryPerry Administrator, Professional Chemist
    You have to use a Carbomer grade that is compatible with anionic surfactants. Carbomer EDT 2020 worked for me to make a clear system. 
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